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DoberVol from downtown, no doubt. That's why at least two old beat writers pay to participate.
It's the reason I spend time around here.
This post was edited by Chartervol 19 months ago
Well, I made the drive to Knoxville Friday and came home this afternoon to Gastonia, NC. I have spent thousands of dollars on the University of Tennessee and Knoxville's economy over the years as have most of you. The fact that most of us are actually PAYING hard earned cash to read news about a football/basketball program shows how dedicated we all are.
As I made the trip home today, I had a lot of time to reflect on yesterday. I was so heartbroken over that loss yesterday and was emotional. As far as I was concerned, the whole team could have been disassembled and it wouldn't have mattered.
With that said, my children haven't gone hungry necessarily because of my obsession with UT Athletics, but we embrace them as a family. My family all gather and watch games together and pull for Tennessee. You, and Bear Bryant, may consider me pathetic, but I love college football, and LOVE the Big Orange. My oldest son (I have 4 children) is 7 years old. He knows our biggest rival is Florida (I know that's debatable, but we consider UF the biggest rival because we have friends that are Gator fans). He is waiting to see his FIRST Tennessee win against the hated Gators! Think about that! His FIRST win. This is getting embarrassing guys! I know these are kids, but they are being rewarded handsomely to play ball. Dooley is being VERY well compensated for his efforts.
I don't want to be the "Fire Dooley Guy" but let me ask you a question. After 3 years, stop asking why should we fire him and ask, what has he done to earn another season. We haven't beat a freaking ranked team! He didn't even have a winning record at his previous job. We were embarrassed on national TV and I have a feeling it'll happen again this year. All I'm saying is, why in the world, other than finances and recruits, would we give him another year?
Let's recall the last time we replaced a Fine Young Man with a Proven Coach. We brought JT Majors in right off a national championship season that featured a Heisman tailback. Majors was a rock star when he hit Knoxville. And a Vol to boot!
At precisely the same stage Dooley is in his rebuilding job, Majors' 79 team lost to Rutgers at homecoming and dope-rolled Notre Dame in a span of seven days. Three years later his Vols managed to lose to Duke and Vanderbilt and beat Alabama in the same year.
Patience, everyone. Proven Coaches don't come out of a multimillion-dollar vending machine, and even when you find one there are no guarantees.
My size exactly. Thank you kindly, Wes.
"Bravely taking to his feet, he beat a very brave retreat." Sir Robin's Minstrels.
wish i had an upvote
Lol +1 I can't lose my cool that would go against my name
I'm not in favor of firing Dooley either because frankly I don't think there is a coach out there, but I do want to put my opinion in about paying a named coach. Alabama got away with hiring Saban for 4 million and we see how that is going for him. I have no idea what the finances of the athletic dept are but I do know that Alabama is not having any problems funding theirs now.
So 6 million for 6 years is not a bad deal if the ROI is 2 NC in 5 years. Now the question is are we Alabama can we recruit like Alabama and USC I'm not sure we can anymore. That is something we lost years ago so we're here with what we have and we all need to support that regardless of what our own thoughts are.
I still say they need to come out and publicly state that Dooley will be here for 2 years or more so that he can recruit on an even playing field and not have the 'hot seat" thrown at him all the time because he is not out recruiting hardly anyone right now.
Best thing to come out of Alabama: I-59 North
1 Corinthians 16:13 Be watchful, stand firm in the faith, act like men, be strong.
What would cost the program more paying a coach $6 million a year, or an average attendance of 75,000?
Dunno, but I bet some teams would love to average 75K per season...
Assume $35 a ticket , that 2.6 mil per home game in ticket sales, that's not profit, that gross ticket sales. We have no idea what the utilities and upkeep cost, but I bet it eats into that 2.6 mil pretty heavily. lets not forget paying salaries and im not just talking about the coaches. There is a small army that run the athletics at UT. Remember ticket sales pay for everything even other sports...
The size and scope of UT is so outside my knowledge its not even funny. Closest i can come to it is Booksamillion, I was aco manager once upon a time and went to thier home office. Was eye opening in understanding how a business is run from the top down. Most of us only get the bottom up view, all we can do is talk big like we know what to do. Let Dave Hart handle it, he has all this info we lack and a understanding we can never get. At least not without knowing everythign Hart does.
Talking about ticket prices...check the tax...14.25%.....that is a big chunk of change.
yup and the University doesnt see a penny of it,im not sure how much the state funds UT, but I bet the recoup alot in taxes.
It's kind of like gas prices, we al grouch about paying 3.70 a gallon( or whatever it happens to be) there is that gasoline tax we pay on every gallon. Government takes in $$$$$ in taxes on gas that rivals the oil companies profits.
Congrats dobervol on getting props from Wes. The thread was outstanding and the discussion was mostly civil.
BUTCH IS NOT FOR THE FAINT OF HEART. GO VOLS!
Don't know how much of that ticket tax goes to the state; Knoxville makes a ton, for which we get a Cumberland Avenue that looks like Fallujah, and of course the horse's ass KPD.
We had a deficit because of all the new construction. The largest one (I assume the new football training facility was the largest) is now complete and UT will be back on the black next fiscal year. Its like the old saying goes you got to spend money to make money. Hart and the people holding the purse strings at UT understand that.
I'm not in the fire Dooley camp just yet, but when the cash cow is sick, you better get her to the Vet quick or you might just lose the farm.
The financials for UTAD...will show we are paying the debt service on serveral projects including most of the parking garages on campus....we will not have all that paid for next year. It also shows funds going to other institutions outside of UTK....part of the bigger University. What may help UTAD a bit is that it is my understanding we do not owe any former Coach for a buyout.
Story on the financials would be an eye opener. Also one on how TN higher funding works...it is different from other states. Support from appropriations has dropped from approx 70% to 30% with UT making up the difference with increases in tuition and more donations (including contributions from UTAD).
Great thread. One of the reasons why I pay to come here. Great discussions, guys, keep it up!
Some cause happiness wherever they go; others whenever they go.
If the budget didn't mean squat, then why did Dooley have to retain several coaches from Kiffin's staff? It's possible he wanted to keep them, but the rumors were that Cutcliffe turned TN down because he couldn't bring his entire staff. I think TN could pay more than $2 million whenever another coaching change is made, but I don't believe they will have a blank check.
In my fantasy... Peyton Manning, Eric Berry, Arian Foster, Jerod Mayo, Denarius Moore, Jason Witten, Robert Meachem, Robert Ayers, Scott Wells, and Chad Clifton get together to form a financial support group. Then, I hire whoever the heck I want.
Why would you think Jim Haslam has a cash flow problem just because he bought the Cleveland Browns? It was a leveraged purchase to ensure he didn't have any cash flow issues.
In addition, the NFL conducts a thorough financial audit of any potential owner to ensure there are no financial problems.
I have no problem with the premise of your question but stop pulling assumptions out of thin air and saying this is real life. It's not.
A helpful resource for anyone trying to make the 1.5-1.9 million a year math to work. FYI, you'll need to scroll down quite a bit to find a coach that makes less than 1.5 million a year right now.
IMO, there are only a few names within your restraints that look remotely appealing: Troy Calhoun, Guz Malzahn, and Jim Mora, Jr.
Calhoun ($950K/yr) has won at Air Force, which is impressive for it being a service academy, but how well would he recruit in the SEC? His coaching history is all in the western part of the United States.
Jim Mora, Jr. just arrived at UCLA, which means he's probably not going anywhere anytime soon for a slight pay raise (he currently makes 1.25 mil/yr). He also spent most of his coaching career out west, except for his stint with the Falcons. For those who want a coach without a losing record, you'd have to rule out Mora, who went 31-33 during his time in the NFL.
Malzahn makes the least of the three mentioned at $800K/year. He's the least proven of the bunch as well. We know he's an excellent offensive coach, having literally written the book on no huddle offense. It'll be interesting to see how he fares with an Arkansas State squad that won 11 games last year.
Are any of those guys better than Dooley? More importantly, are they so much better than him as to negate recruting and transfer attrition?
First, the Cleveland Browns purchase was thrown in as an aside, b/c Haslam had just simply refused to pay the most of a big dollar coach before, but it seems to me the purchase wasn't too leveraged, since he agreed to pay over A BILLION DOLLARS for the team. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-08-03/haslam-agrees-to-buy-cleveland-browns-for-more-than-1-billion.html
Structured purchase or not, that's a lot of money, even for someone who's filthy rich. I didn't say he was rendered insolvent by the deal, but I still don't see him as getting involved with paying the salary of a dream coach right now.
If you have any evidence that Jim would be convinced after repeatedly saying no to it, and in addition buying an NFL team, have at it. Hey, if I were Hart and I had decided to fire Dooley, regardless (which I don't think is smart right now, for numerous reasons, but hypothetically), I'd still ask him for the heck of it, but there's a snowball's chance.
Why not agree when Kiff was hired; when CDD was hired; but now agree to? "Because THIS time the fans are really, really, really, really, mad, and before they were only two reallys' worth of mad, so you should really feel obligated to, and hey, you're really, really, really, really rich, so it's no big deal, right?"
Good luck with that. Sometimes I think UT fans gauge rich fans by the adolescent behaviour of the uber-rich Texas and Oklahoma oilmen-children like T.Boone Pickens, who paid almost all the money for almost all of Okie St's facilities, including the stadium, which he has repeatedly and arrogantly (even if accurately) referred to as HIS stadium. T. Boone is NOT representative of very many ultra-rich boosters, and despite making money in the same general area, Jim Haslam isn't like Pickens.
This post was edited by doberVol 19 months ago
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