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1. 3 fairly full classes by Dooleys 2010-2012 classes vs the 2007-2009 classes of Fulmer/Kiffin that had tons of attrition and as I will later discuss....very few even average SEC players among them. The 2007 and 2009 classes have been labeled by many experts as 2 of the top 10 worst SEC classes of that decade and the 2008 class only had 16-17 players in it, only three 4* players, and only 6-7 that really contributed in 2011 or 2012(their SR or RS SR year) for Dooley. Among that 2008 class, only Dallas Thomas and a juco DL G. Williams (only played for Dooley 1 year IIRC being a juco) started consistently out that 2008 class on the DLine or Oline...maybe you could make the case for 2* DT M Hughes in 2010 before he got kicked off the team but we will get back to the lack of "big uglies" Dooley inherited later on.
2. While Jones inherits a 2010 SR class that will probably not include Bray, Hunter and maybe even J. James it will have 6-8 quality SEC quality starting true SRs along with RS SRs from the 2009 class like M. Walls, D. Hood, and N. Oliver who showed he very well might contribute a lot in his final year. The roster also will probably have on it from the juco ranks SRs B. Moore, Couch, Sentimore, and maybe even D. McCullers. That is possibly 13-15 quality SRs that have experience playing in the SEC. What Did Dooley inherit for quality SRs? G. Williams, L. Stocker, G. Jones, C. Walker and D. Moore + a maybe a case could be made for a very few others like injured Ben Martin or ? to make up 6-8 quality SEC SRs. Vitually half of what Jones inherits coming into the 2013 season.
3. Jones inherits a new $40+ million dollar state of the art indoor training facility that only 1-2 other teams in America can counter. 1 being Oregon who UT rarely goes head to head with for a recruit. Neyland Stadium has also been given a make over and many of those renovations were sorely needed 3 years ago. Jones also inherits a VFL program that has even more portential now that A. Davis has been hired. While problems are still very apparent among Athletics vs Academics and in the revenue line of the Athletic Dept...those areas have at least been brought to the attention of everyone and identified and many have already started to be addressed.
4. I know its does not seem like much but all but some stability has been restored (this might be a reach). Outside of about 3-4 RS SRs from the 2009 class this roster will have only known Dooley as a HC and IMO many of the "bad apples" are no longer on this team. 1 coach for the last 3 years is better than 3 coaches in 2 years (Fall of 2008-Jan 2010). This program is more stable and appears it will not suffer the gigantic attrition that destroys a program after a coaching change like we went through with Fulmer and Kiffin back to back years just prior to Dooley.
5. Butch Jones was hired at the only ideal time to make a coaching change. Mid Dec. is light years better than Jan. 15th when Dooley was hired. It gave Jones a perfect time to assemble a staff and recruit this last full week, evaluate recruits, his returning roster and this program during the dead period and have a full January 2013 for him and his staff to be on the road, in the homes of recruits, and hosting official visitors. Dooley had only 2.5 weeks and IIRC only 2 weekends to host OVs. Dooley also had to hire a staff, organize what staff he hired on who to target after doing a few quick evaluations. Coming from La Tech and who they targeted was a disadvantage to Dooley in Jan 2010 vs who Jones has offered and recruited coming from a much better program in Cincy. The transition to the talent level (or more importantly the existing relationships with that talent level) that UT recruits is not as great with Jones coming from Cincy as it was for Dooley coming from La Tech. Jones staff has more than likely either offered the player prior, met with the player and/or HS coach or evaluated the prospect or have done all 3 that they are now recruiting for UT.
More to come later today regarding the talent per position Dooley inherited vs what Jones has inherited.
This post has been edited 2 times, most recently by SamVolsam on 12/15/2012 at 5:57 AM
SamVolsam
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SamVolsam said...
1. 3 fairly full classes by Dooleys 2010-2012 classes vs the 2007-2009 classes of Fulmer/Kiffin that had tons of attrition and as I will later discuss....very few even average SEC players among them. The 2007 and 2009 classes have been labeled by many experts as 2 of the top 10 worst SEC classes of that decade and the 2008 class only had 16-17 players in it, only three 4* players, and only 6-7 that really contributed in 2011 or 2012(their SR or RS SR year) for Dooley. Among that 2008 class, only Dallas Thomas and a juco DL G. Williams (only played for Dooley 1 year IIRC being a juco) started consistently out that 2008 class on the DLine or Oline...maybe you could make the case for 2* DT M Hughes in 2010 before he got kicked off the team but we will get back to the lack of "big uglies" Dooley inherited later on.
2. While Jones inherits a 2010 SR class that will probably not include Bray, Hunter and maybe even J. James it will have 6-8 quality SEC quality starting true SRs along with RS SRs from the 2009 class like M. Walls, D. Hood, and N. Oliver who showed he very well might contribute a lot in his final year. The roster also will probably have on it from the juco ranks SRs B. Moore, Couch, Sentimore, and maybe even D. McCullers. That is possibly 13-15 quality SRs that have experience playing in the SEC. What Did Dooley inherit for quality SRs? G. Williams, L. Stocker, G. Jones, C. Walker and D. Moore + a maybe a case could be made for a very few others like injured Ben Martin or ? to make up 6-8 quality SEC SRs. Vitually half of what Jones inherits coming into the 2013 season.
3. Jones inherits a new $40+ million dollar state of the art indoor training facility that only 1-2 other teams in America can counter. 1 being Oregon who UT rarely goes head to head with for a recruit. Neyland Stadium has also been given a make over and many of those renovations were sorely needed 3 years ago. Jones also inherits a VFL program that has even more portential now that A. Davis has been hired. While problems are still very apparent among Athletics vs Academics and in the revenue line of the Athletic Dept...those areas have at least been brought to the attention of everyone and identified and many have already started to be addressed.
4. I know its does not seem like much but all but some stability has been restored (this might be a reach). Outside of about 3-4 RS SRs from the 2009 class this roster will have only known Dooley as a HC and IMO many of the "bad apples" are no longer on this team. 1 coach for the last 3 years is better than 3 coaches in 2 years (Fall of 2008-Jan 2010). This program is more stable and appears it will not suffer the gigantic attrition that destroys a program after a coaching change like we went through with Fulmer and Kiffin back to back years just prior to Dooley.
5. Butch Jones was hired at the only ideal time to make a coaching change. Mid Dec. is light years better than Jan. 15th when Dooley was hired. It gave Jones a perfect time to assemble a staff and recruit this last full week, evaluate recruits, his returning roster and this program during the dead period and have a full January 2013 for him and his staff to be on the road, in the homes of recruits, and hosting official visitors. Dooley had only 2.5 weeks and IIRC only 2 weekends to host OVs. Dooley also had to hire a staff, organize what staff he hired on who to target after doing a few quick evaluations. Coming from La Tech and who they targeted was a disadvantage to Dooley in Jan 2010 vs who Jones has offered and recruited coming from a much better program in Cincy. The transition to the talent level (or more importantly the existing relationships with that talent level) that UT recruits is not as great with Jones coming from Cincy as it was for Dooley coming from La Tech. Jones staff has more than likely either offered the player prior, met with the player and/or HS coach or evaluated the prospect or have done all 3 that they are now recruiting for UT.
More to come later today regarding the talent per position Dooley inherited vs what Jones has inherited.
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Jersey Vol
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JCJ1986
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Jersey Vol said...
Very good points, Sam. The only thing that scares me is our schedule this year. I still think we have a chance for 7 or 8 wins, but it won't be easy. Those trips to Oregon, UF and Bammer are gonna be brutal.
This post was edited by SamVolsam on 12/15/2012 at 7:53 AM
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SamVolsam
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UTFPMD
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ol dad
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GoBigO said...
I actually think playing Bama and UF on the road next year is a good thing. Those would be very tough games for us anyway, even if at home. I think having UGA, USCe, Auburn, and Vandy at home provides a better chance of getting some good SEC wins than if we had to play those teams on the road.
I think you may be on to something thereSamVolsam
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GoBigO said...
I actually think playing Bama and UF on the road next year is a good thing. Those would be very tough games for us anyway, even if at home. I think having UGA, USCe, Auburn, and Vandy at home provides a better chance of getting some good SEC wins than if we had to play those teams on the road.
muddy waters
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GoBigO said...
I actually think playing Bama and UF on the road next year is a good thing. Those would be very tough games for us anyway, even if at home. I think having UGA, USCe, Auburn, and Vandy at home provides a better chance of getting some good SEC wins than if we had to play those teams on the road.
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SamVolsam said...
No doubt that its is hard with Oregon as an ooc game but outside that game its the same ole SEC schedule that every year minus going on the road for our 3 toughest games like you said. 6 reg. season wins seems to be a good over/under just because of our roster issues at DB (esp with BR coming off injury and not knowing if Bonner will even be here) but also due to the extreme inexperience at QB, WR, and CB. The thing that is different with 2013 v 2010 is we do have returning players with talent at those positions...while maybe not starters, they have been in the program training and practicing. Another thing to consider is the offensive scheme will be totally new and I expect there to be a transition period where everything is not running on auto pilot. I do thing a simplied defensive scheme will be an advantage going back to a 4 man front.
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Jersey Vol said...
Very good points, Sam. The only thing that scares me is our schedule this year. I still think we have a chance for 7 or 8 wins, but it won't be easy. Those trips to Oregon, UF and Bammer are gonna be brutal.
This post was edited by tntoak on 12/15/2012 at 12:33 PM
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RockytopATL said...
We have potential talent at QB, but very little experience, which is just as important if not more. Most of Worley's game action is two years past. Peterman has never taken a college snap.
Teams with inexperienced QBs historically do not fare well.
Go Vols
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What Jones inherits vs what Dooley inherited....